June 2011 Rotation Feedback

[Fano]

what is the obsession with toy_fort? I don't find it fun at all.

most of the maps in this rotation seem gimmicky and/or badly designed, I'd be up for some more gameplay oriented customs on the server, some of my favorites:

ctf_haarp, I played some of the earlier versions but I don't know if it ever got updated, but I enjoyed it a lot, ctf_snowdrift was also a map with a similar A/D ctf style that I enjoyed.

cp_gullywash, a map aimed at the competitive crowd but I find that it works quite well in 12v12 as well.

cp_snakewater, see above.

the mirrored versions of officials can be a cool little gimmick to have: http://www.khuntza.net/TF2MirroredMapsSeries1.html
and series 2: http://www.khuntza.net/TF2MirroredMapsSeries2.html

I'd also like to give the maps recently promoted on the tf2 blog a try: http://asymmetrycp.tf2maps.net/

[One_Medic_Army]

pl_waste_v2 Haven't played this enough to form an opinion, seemed interesting though
cp_observatory4 it's alright, never really played on it apart from melee-only seeding
cp_toy_fort Fun quick map, I'd just suggest some class limit changes, great at filling the server, put this in as our seed map
pl_deplane_b5 Not a big fan, would love to see it get replaced with another map
cp_blazewalk_rc5 One of my favorite maps, my favorite map on the server, would love to see it move up in the order a little, since by the time we get there we've generally lost people from deplane
pl_stovepipe_b3 Same opinion as deplane, though at least stovepipe doesn't have the long sections of separated pathway

[Flash]

pl_waste_v2 - don't mind it when we have a good crowd, but probably wouldn't miss it.
cp_observatory4 - like it, fairly small map which is good for empty server
cp_toy_fort - I really enjoy the compactness of this map.
pl_deplane_b5 - Take it or leave it.
cp_blazewalk_rc5 - I like it, but gets tedious with small crowds.
pl_stovepipe_b3 - I wouldn't miss this one. It just takes so long to catch back up with the action after death on BLU.

[Flaming Cheese Wheel]

A comment on a comment:

cp_desertfortress is a very well designed map, though it's a bit of a sniper trap

I'm okay with Desertfortress, with the exact same reservation about it.

cp_science, I always like the design behind this one, though it's lack of linear 5-cpness doesn't help.

I also like Science, except that even after playing it many times I'm still thrown off by how the forward spawns are designed to make you get lost in the map and run in the wrong direction. Also the center point is easily Wranglered into submission now.

ctf_convoy, not a good rotation map, but a fun map for fun times. Despite the bad layout, this map is pretty cool.
pl_cranetop, I don't remember this one, but I recall this being an interesting 3-stage payload map where the first cap required blu to remain on a point rather than push the cart.

Convoy and Cranetop were both broken by the last huge update. They crash the server.

ctf_mach4, a small, fast paced, but somewhat chokepoint-ish map that I spent much of my time on when I first started playing TF2

This is still okay up until someone uses the Wrangler outside. Then it's kinda horrifying.

ctf_rugby, a little on the open side and a bit strange on mechanics, but this map implements a football-style CTF, where there's a single flag and the goal is to take it to the enemy's side. (think BBall, but with more than just soldiers)

I want to give this a shot.

ctf_vikings_final, another map that's epic, but has relitivly poor map design. Similar to convoy.

It's available on the server, but I wouldn't want to have it in the rotation.

melee_ringking, in the event that a melee duel must be invoked and the meleemania map is not avalible...

I prefer Meleebarn.

A point that I want to second: The rotation needs to be longer than it is now, maybe at least twice as long. We've occasionally gone through the entire rotation while trying to get a seed going.

Also, we seem to like playing and seeding on tc_hydro on TV1, what about a new territory control map? Like tc_meridian?

Having actually played Meridian, it's... okay. Not sure it's worth the giant download.

[Supreveio]

pl_waste_v2 -- No opinion, as I have yet to actually play this map with a good amount of players. Though I think the CP version would work better. (Verdict: Replace with CP version)
cp_observatory4 -- I'm tired of this map. It was good back when it was first released, but now it's kinda meh. (Verdict: Replace)
cp_toy_fort -- I don't really like this map. There's pretty much only one path to follow, the final BLU point is broken... But it fills the server. So I don't know. (Verdict: ????)
pl_deplane_b5 -- No opinion, as I haven't played this one with very many people either, but the map itself isn't too exciting. (Verdict: Replace)
cp_blazewalk_rc5 -- I like this map. It's fun and I think it should stay. (Verdict: Keep)
pl_stovepipe_b3 -- This map is getting a little stale. It's visually unappealing because everything is orange up until you get to the third point, plus it's old and I don't think Nineaxis is going to be making any changes any time soon. (Verdict: Replace)

Personally, I think we should add more "serious" maps and keep the "silly" maps for special occasions. Mostly because the official game modes are easy to remember the rules for. Stuff like balloonrace and wackyraces are confusing to new players (plus they're glitchy)

My vote is to test the TF2Maps (A)Symmetrical CP Contest maps, then add the ones we like best to the server "officially".

[TheCarpe]

what is the obsession with toy_fort? I don't find it fun at all.

Because other people have opinions that differ from yours

Some of the classic customs I used to love just don't work with the new stuff. Mach4 is a prime example, that was one of my favorite maps a couple years ago. Then we tried it on a classic customs night and uuuugh. It didn't age well. Lazytown was another good one, but it required patience since it took soooo looooong to traverse.

I still may be the only living proponent of dbheights (the payload remake of Dustbowl).

[jav]

is the custom map server generally meant for normal or goofy gameplay? if the latter, i suggest more wacky/balloon races, some dodgeball, and basketball. might also be cool to have medieval mode maps rather than just the typical melee ring stuff.

for normal gameplay, i don't think the current maps are that good. i don't remember all the names of the ones i've played, but toy fort (narrow, chokepointy, ugly, not as cool as the rats maps in cs) and some of the long-winding/intricate (too much clutter) maps aren't that fun to play.

[Plinko]

The reason a lot of people don't see pl_waste is that most of the time, whoever starts seeding changes the map to toy_fort and the rotation moves on from there, leaving waste as the last map you'd see.

We should keep all gimmick maps out of the rotation, having them available for votes/admin changes is OK so we can play them sometimes, but if we do get the place going it's bad to switch gears to one.

Meridian is bad, not a very good map, plus it drives away people as it takes forever to download.

[One_Medic_Army]

So why not switch the rotation to:
Toyfort initial, since it seeds the best.
pl_waste second, for a change of game mode
cp_blazewalk after that
then whatever new maps we feel like adding, hopefully some payloads, as it looks like nobody likes either deplane or stovepipe

I'm personally OK with adding in a short session of degroot keep or meleebarn for variety.

[Boss Llama]

I still may be the only living proponent of dbheights (the payload remake of Dustbowl).

I also like dbheights

[Flash]

I'm personally OK with adding in a short session of degroot keep...

I actually wouldn't mind some Degroot Keep on there either. I know it isn't a custom map but seems like it would fit better on TV2 than one of the other servers.

[Stevo]

So far, I've come to the following conclusions based on your feedback. Keep the feedback coming.

We should remove:
pl_deplane
pl_stovepipe

We should add:
ctf_haarp
cp_desertfortress

We should move cp_toy_fort to the beginning of the rotation and cp_blazewalk earlier in the rotation.

Questions:
Do you prefer pl_waste or cp_waste?

Does anyone else have opinions on these suggested maps?:
koth_lolcano
cp_labor
cp_ironbowl
cp_gullywash
cp_snakewater
pl_dbheights

[One_Medic_Army]

Labor is a good map.
lolcano is right on the edge between put in and too goofy, so later on in the rotation?

As to the rest, no idea.

[Flaming Cheese Wheel]

Lolcano is either something you run while goofing off waiting to seed, or something that comes up later in the rotation for the people that have bothered to stay on for four hours. I enjoy its silliness, but I can see how it might freak people out a little.

I was also the one who suggested Labor, so I don't really have anything to add about it.

When we tried Ironbowl a month or so ago, I remember us being both intrigued and very, very confused about what was going on. I tested out the generally-similar Canalzone and I think that open-capture maps will not do well unless people really know what they're doing.

Gullywash seems popular out in The World, so I think that adding it would not be a problem. And I like 5CP.

I don't think I've ever played Snakewater.

Dbheights is... okay. Overall I think it reminds me too much of Dustbowl.

[Plinko]

If lolcano is a weird/silly map, we should not put it in.

I recall disliking ironbowl but not why.

Never played labor, snakewater or gullywash, so there's that.

I also like dbheights, and I recall it used to seed so it's not a bad idea to try.