Hints and Tips for playing TF2

A place to discuss strategies and methods of playing
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Post by l3eeron » Wed Jun 18, 2008 3:19 pm

Well, here's a point that has stuck with me from playing 1.3...

If you're moving forward, you don't have to look behind yourself as much, allowing you more time to look for targets.


This theory doesn't work as good in TF2 because of the differnce in speed between the classes. But it works good in games where everyone is the same speed.

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Re: Hints and Tips for playing TF2

Post by Nick Mame » Tue Jun 24, 2008 3:43 pm

Uhh... I want to mention something about the soldier again. I just saw that the syringe gun has more kills in the past 21 days than the soldier's shotgun... while Torven may be inflating the statistics, that's just not right!

With the new pyro update especially, it's somewhat crucial soldiers-in-training learn how to master their shotguns. A lot of your rocket shots won't be as effective as they previously were thanks to air blast, and in quite a few situations rockets are now inferior to shotgun shells.


I can't precisely tell you when the shotgun is better than the rocket launcher: I never really pay attention to what I do while soldier, a lot of it has become instinct. I'll try to pay a bit more attention to get some specifics for hints and tips, but the shotgun isn't a worthless weapon given to the soldier so he'd have an arsenal of three. It actually suits him quite well.


The best I can do right now is leave you with a tidbit of why soldiers who use rockets alone are sloppy:

When cp_badlands was first released, I was a rather novice soldier who never touched anything but the rocket launcher. Since I was a soldier and most things imploded on sight, I felt fairly high and mighty and confident in my abilities to crush anything on a public server. Then this fellow came in, another soldier, with fairly decent rocket prediction and a knack for rocket jumping at the right time. Mental thought: "Heh... someone fancies himself a soldier. Time to crush him and let him know his place."

Now on cp_badlands there is a capture point on a spire with a lot of open areas around it. A lot of the fighting took place on that deal, with my soldier friend defending it and me launching myself up for attack. Because of how cramped that spire is once you are on it, most rockets you fire will hurt yourself. So the gist of what happened: I launch myself onto the spire, this other soldier sees me and switches to his shotgun, I fire two rockets, I blow myself up, he stays quite well and fit on that point with half health.

I never won a single fight against that soldier (at the time!) without having to blow myself up with a point-blank rocket. The reason was simple: I didn't use anything but rockets. When it comes to up-close fighting, the soldier with the better shotgun experience will win the fight. If you rely on nothing but your rockets (especially now that the 40% reduction has been removed), you will accomplish nothing but getting yourself blown up while he chips away at your health with his shotgun. And there is nothing graceful about blowing yourself up. A true victory is your opponent's death with minimal damage on your side.


I doubt my story will convert people to shotgun usage, more of a personal thing. But if you ever see me, come on at me with your rocket launcher. If you survive my shotgun, I will be impressed.

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Post by So Uncivilized » Tue Jun 24, 2008 4:28 pm

Nick this is valid advice for all of the classes, really.


For the longest time, I just didn't care to use the pyro shotgun, and having recently changed my control config, I will tend to be a sloppy switcher for a while. Before that, I was getting pretty good at flaming and then switching out.

Same with heavy; I see a lot of guys trying frantically to spin up when caught off guard. Keep that shotty out when you're in 'safe' areas. You can shotgun spies and scouts pretty easily.

Of course there are also the pistols, both scout and engie. I've killed some stuff in pretty cool ways with those. As scout, if I see a big tangle of enemies and friends, dancing around in the distance and firing in with the pistol keeps you from getting pyro-fried :)

And the engie pistol is fun in the same vein.



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Post by BlackHawk » Tue Jun 24, 2008 4:44 pm

Remeber, JD is an old man, so he can not see well. Hold still around him and you are safe, as he can only see the blurry movements without his glasses. Or just mention boobs and say they are in his spawn and he will spend an hour searching for them
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Post by Gizanked » Tue Jun 24, 2008 4:44 pm

i feel like most of the people with a strong tfc background will know the importance of a shotgun. the supershotty was my weapon of choice back then.. and whats better than instant damage exactly where you are aiming from half way across the map?
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Re: Hints and Tips for playing TF2

Post by Nick Mame » Tue Jun 24, 2008 4:48 pm

I find that fists are a better defense for an off-guard heavy. When I say off-guard, I mean in the middle of enemy territory suddenly turning a corner and finding a pyro when no medics are in sight. Shotgun requires too much aim to be of great help in a frantic situation unless you have scout-like aim.

So far, the only use I've found for the heavy's shotgun is when he's waddling to the front as a means to take pot-shots at distant enemies or spies (which is probably more of what you were hinting at). If you want to move forward as a heavy, use the shotgun.

But I haven't played heavy enough to feel confident on my advice towards him.

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Re: Hints and Tips for playing TF2

Post by Torven » Tue Jun 24, 2008 5:32 pm

[quote="Nick Mame";p="102543"]Uhh... I want to mention something about the soldier again. I just saw that the syringe gun has more kills in the past 21 days than the soldier's shotgun... while Torven may be inflating the statistics, that's just not right!

With the new pyro update especially, it's somewhat crucial soldiers-in-training learn how to master their shotguns. A lot of your rocket shots won't be as effective as they previously were thanks to air blast, and in quite a few situations rockets are now inferior to shotgun shells.


I can't precisely tell you when the shotgun is better than the rocket launcher: I never really pay attention to what I do while soldier, a lot of it has become instinct. I'll try to pay a bit more attention to get some specifics for hints and tips, but the shotgun isn't a worthless weapon given to the soldier so he'd have an arsenal of three. It actually suits him quite well.


The best I can do right now is leave you with a tidbit of why soldiers who use rockets alone are sloppy:

When cp_badlands was first released, I was a rather novice soldier who never touched anything but the rocket launcher. Since I was a soldier and most things imploded on sight, I felt fairly high and mighty and confident in my abilities to crush anything on a public server. Then this fellow came in, another soldier, with fairly decent rocket prediction and a knack for rocket jumping at the right time. Mental thought: "Heh... someone fancies himself a soldier. Time to crush him and let him know his place."

Now on cp_badlands there is a capture point on a spire with a lot of open areas around it. A lot of the fighting took place on that deal, with my soldier friend defending it and me launching myself up for attack. Because of how cramped that spire is once you are on it, most rockets you fire will hurt yourself. So the gist of what happened: I launch myself onto the spire, this other soldier sees me and switches to his shotgun, I fire two rockets, I blow myself up, he stays quite well and fit on that point with half health.

I never won a single fight against that soldier (at the time!) without having to blow myself up with a point-blank rocket. The reason was simple: I didn't use anything but rockets. When it comes to up-close fighting, the soldier with the better shotgun experience will win the fight. If you rely on nothing but your rockets (especially now that the 40% reduction has been removed), you will accomplish nothing but getting yourself blown up while he chips away at your health with his shotgun. And there is nothing graceful about blowing yourself up. A true victory is your opponent's death with minimal damage on your side.


I doubt my story will convert people to shotgun usage, more of a personal thing. But if you ever see me, come on at me with your rocket launcher. If you survive my shotgun, I will be impressed.[/quote]

Your shotgun greatly vexes me. If I don't think I can get away from soldiers, usually I start a banzai charge in the hopes that the blautsauger can keep me alive long enough that if the final rocket doesn't kill us both, it leaves them weak enough someone else can easily finish them off.
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Re: Hints and Tips for playing TF2

Post by Nick Mame » Thu Jul 03, 2008 2:19 am

The Art of Headhunting
While I might not have the same finesse at the sniper as I do with the medic (quite rusty) and soldier, I feel familiar enough with the class to offer tips on anything but how to aim (still don't quite have that down!). If you are considering polishing your sniper in preperation for the heavy update, its important to start with a solid foundation instead of doing everything wrong for the first 40 hours.


Training your Aim:
It's pretty hard to get a headshot off a second after scoping on a moving target while being bombarded with rocket fire. You probably shouldn't strive to do that from the start. Instead, start with some tricks:

1) Use stealth. Sit in an unexpected (and perhaps useless) sniping position and attempt to score some headshots from a spot where no one will retaliate against you. The key to improving aim would be practice. You can get a lot of practice off if you fire enough shots in one life to run out of ammo. You'll likely miss a lot. You'll likely be useless to the team. But don't worry! Other players expect snipers to be useless! It's better for a serious trainee to have a period of complete and utter uselessness than to attempt to be useful in an unsucessful way. Rather than wasting your time with bodyshots which teach you nothing of aim, resign yourself to a period where you will be a hamper to your team. You'll make up for it once you've improved.

The jist of this point: AVOID BATTLEMENTS. An inexperienced sniper should not be on the battlements. They are a deathtrap to those who cannot get off split-second shots.

2) Avoid other snipers. Continuing the trend of being generally useless, an inexperienced sniper should not attempt to engage in a sniper war. They are often infuriating and time consuming. You will not learn how to aim during a sniper war. At best, you will pull off a lucky bodyshot after your fifth or so death. It's far better if you learn how to aim off of non-snipers (who can't hurt you) so you are experienced enough to actually survive an encounter with another sniper. Of course, if you want to test your skill at aiming relative to another player, feel free to indulge. If you are a sniper, you are destined to have sniper wars. I just recommend to avoid them as much as possible until you have a small chance of survival.

3) Lay a trap. This is a tip that stems from my soldier heritage: player movements are easy to predict. A good way to get a feel for where to shoot and when the trigger should be pulled is to keep your aim level as that player dances all over the place trying to avoid your shot. Wait for them to 'dance' into your shot. Place your dot on a wall near a player. They will start running around crazy-like. When their head appears on your dot, fire. Don't try to keep up with their movements, let them walk right into you.

A warning here: real shots involve aim, not prediction. This method is the 'training wheels' method used solely to get a feel for when a shot would be a headshot and when the trigger should be pulled. Do NOT stop after other players get good at walking into your trap. You may use this third method as a means to get familiar with the rifle; you should not continue to use this method (frequently) after you become more experienced.


DO NOT single out heavies as your targets and think that managing a headshot on one of them means anything of importance. You should take out heavies to at least be somewhat useful to the team, but you should also try hitting the medic behind them for some actual sniper experience.

DO NOT pre-charge a shot and stare at an empty doorway waiting for something to come through. With the Lay a Trap method, you should at least be aware of the individual before you aim. You should go through the practice of getting into position and spontaneously aiming in at least their general direction. It does you no good to figure out exactly where to aim on a map to get a headshot when someone turns that particular corner. What happens when you want to kill someone at that other corner?


What I've mentioned to this point relates only to snipers-in-training. It's a method for you to improve your aim in an implausible and often unhelpful way. You should not consider the above tips relevant to real snipers. Rather, they are a crutch to help one reach the level of a real sniper. Once you become more experienced, that cruch and all the above tips will be abandoned.


Training Edicate:
There are two things I want to mention before we get into the helpful portion. Since I have thus far advocated that you be a hamper to your team and avoid being useful, there are some rules you should follow to make the experience as painless as possible.

1) If there is another sniper, switch classes. It's alright if there is a single useless sniper on the team. A lot of people won't even notice that you exist. It's when they see three or so snipers standing in the same place that they start complaining. You'll be a hindrance on your team while training; don't be a further hindrance by training during an improper (sniper-heavy) time.

2) If your team is losing by a fair margin, switch classes. It's alright to be useless on a team that's holding its own or dominating the opposition. People won't complain about winning. However, you should not be a hindrance to the team by training when your fellow teammates are getting absolutely crushed. You've accepted a cruel and dominated fate through the decision to train; your team expects to win. Don't be useless when your team needs your help.


REVIEW:
1) Pick a proper time for training. Do it on a winning team with no other snipers.
2) Decide against training when the other team has multiple snipers.
3) Avoid battlements and stick to low-key positions.
4) Aim for the head and miss half the time.


Hazards for a Sniper:
1) Pre-Charged Shots. A solid sniper does not arise from staring through that scope with a full charge looking around for a head to snipe. While you are looking through your scope for the next target: a soldier is preparing to rocket jump up to you, a pyro is walking up those stairs to your right, and a spy is hovering over your back. You've likely heard the term tunnel-medic. There are also tunnel-snipers. If you use your scope when there are no targets in sight, you are missing the key targets you should be sniping. You are letting an uber-charged medic pass through your peripheral. It's critical you have maximum awareness at all times to find the most crucial targets. It's critical you be aware of your surroundings so you don't die and become useless until you reposition yourself.

Solution? Charge when you spot a head. All classes (except the heavy, who isn't going anywhere) will die to a relatively short amount of charge. If you don't have time for a full-charge, a headshot will still send them running with their critical health. It's not necessary to have a charge waiting; you can easily charge after spotting and still get off that headshot in time.

The most common pitfalls of this nature:
-snipers who charge a shot and then slowly inch out onto the battlements. This behavior is just plain fail. The entire world can see you coming from a mile away (hint: your shoulder appears on those battlements before you can see beyond your wall) while you have no idea where anything is. You are charging into a fight blind. Even if you have an insta-kill rail gun, it's not much use if you don't know where to aim it. You come around that corner, go blind from the sight of something besides your wall, spend two seconds spinning around frantically looking for where your intended target ran off to, then find out he's behind you. It doesn't work.

-snipers who stand stationary in their preferred sniping spot scanning the horizons for the next victim. This behavior is a bit better, but still fail. The problem is that every other sniper out there knows exactly where you are. You'll die before even seeing them since they know where to aim before even getting in your sights. You've restricted your field of vision by using the scope; you've rendered yourself useless when you have to dodge that rocket after wasting five plus seconds for the full-charge; you've put up a giant billboard to the opposing team stating exactly where you will be without fail.


2) 'Safe' Snipers. Good shots don't come from standing around one or so points back (and in some instances [2fort!], on the map-intended battlements). You shouldn't sit in your little watch tower and wait for the enemy to come to you. While you stand next to that engineer who's been hitting his sentry for hours (the very sentry that has yet to fire a single round!), thinking about how useless he is and how he's bringing the whole team down (hint: he's in good company!), there is a medic behind that corner off in the distance charging his uber. If you had advanced, you could have taken that darn medic down... but as it stands, well.. both you and that sentry are facing a rather nasty demoman.

Solution? Stay with the front. You're as safe on the front as you'd be in some remote locale. Not much is going to be heading towards you when a nasty heavy and his medic companion are at hand. You'll find much more crucial shots when you're on the front. You'll be helping your team when you take out critical targets on the front. And you'll actually get to snipe things on the front!

The most common pitfalls of this nature:
-doorways. Snipers just love aiming at doorways. You actually want to be aiming at what's behind that doorway, waiting to wreck havok on your entire team unless you move foward and take it out. Think of it this way. Snipers should be considered a prevention mechanism. They are what prevent nasty things from tormenting our dear friend the engineer. You kill what could endanger the engineer and his sentry takes care of what leaks through the cracks. However, if you aim at a doorway, you are not a preventative. You didn't prevent the enemy from reaching the sentry, you just took care of them when you arrived. His sentry could easily replace you at that point. So move forward and prevent ubers from being charged. Don't sit back and stare at them when they happen to pass through.

-battlements. Seriously, these things are magnets. Every projectile weapon in the game slowly gravitates towards them ensuring the complete and utter annihlation of any sniper foolish enough to step foot on their threshold. The purpose of a battlement is to provide a single location which offers a huge vantage point from which any shot could be made. TF2 does not work like that. It's a game of motion. Things which are stationary, such as sentries, tend to die. Things which are mobile, such as scouts, tend to live. If you sit on the battlements and take shots from there, it's quite true you will have a good view of all the action. However, you should (unless you are a god of a sniper who can perform any shot (or unless the map has no other viable sniping locations)) always be on the move. Reposition yourself for each shot. Listen to your teammates to know where the enemy will be coming from and find the perfect spot to take on their arrival. If you are mobile, you will be hard to find. If you are hard to find, you will be hard to kill. And if you are good, things will die the whole while. Stay mobile, stay alive, stay killing.


Good Behavior!
I'll now outline some tips to how to be an effective (or at least how to act like an effective) sniper:

1) Stay mobile on the outskirts of the front until a head is spotted. Search for something to aim at (without your scope!) or listen to friendly chatter and reposition yourself for an impending shot. Consistently be aware of your surroundings to ensure you are not being ambushed or something is not slipping through the front. Avoid doorways and chokepoints unless you are confident the other side is clear.

2) React to major events. If you see that you are losing a point, position yourself to get a good shot at the heads running around on it. If you see you are capturing a point, move forward to help support the offense. If you see you are losing your intel, watch which way it goes and prepare for their arrival. If you see you are gaining the intel, knock of the heads following it. If you see a large number of people dying to an enemy sniper, predict where he will be and take him out.

3) Priotize critical targets. If your advance has encountered a sentry, take out the engineer so the gun will quickly fall. If its a heavy instead, take him down. If a medic is holding the entire defense together, focus on him. While on the defense, take out whoever is causing the most damage. While on the offense, take out whoever is posing the biggest obstacle (often engineers and heavies!). When on neither, take the best shot.


Parting Words:
You shouldn't be afraid to get involve in a point-blank snipe fest. I'd encourage you to do so. I've taken out numerous heavies by hiding in a corner and waiting for them to brush right on by. I've taken out entire offenses by running towards them while pausing every other second for a deadly split-second headshot. Sniping isn't about standing on the far battlements picking ants off in the distance. It's about seeing any head anywhere and managing to pull off the shot.



I left a lot unsaid. All I really wanted with this post was to discourage the behavior which tends to lead to bad snipers, which explains the high degree of negativity contained within. If you expect to go sniper as a counter to heavy, and you expect that you might consider continuing with the sniper afterwards, avoid the pitfalls I've listed here. Almost every single sniper falls into them. If you just read through this guide and try to avoid the behaviors I've mentioned, you'll be a huge asset to your team even if you cannot properly aim. You'll be among the elite of snipers without even being able to pull off a shot!

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Re: Hints and Tips for playing TF2

Post by Tarrock » Thu Jul 03, 2008 3:41 am

who's ready for some Tarrock Advice Comics!?!?!?!?

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[img]http://i509.photobucket.com/albums/s335/TopHatDesign/demoteam3Tarrock.png[/img]

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Post by l3eeron » Thu Jul 03, 2008 9:18 am

:rofl:

OMG!!! I almost broke a rib laughing at that! :lol: x 1,000


And, wow Nick, nice post. I gladly take your advice. :D

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Post by Portland_BEER » Thu Jul 03, 2008 3:56 pm

I want to hire Tarrock to do my sig :lol:
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Re: Hints and Tips for playing TF2

Post by Nick Mame » Tue Jul 29, 2008 1:35 am

Approaching the Sticky-Launcher
When a demoman prone to stickies surprises you in such a way that you have a sudden desire to retreat, you will want to charge the demoman head on. A lot of demomen operate under the principle of, "Why bother to aim when I could have you walk right into a trap?". They'll be launching stickies behind you with the intent of detonating them once you try to retreat. If you charge most demomen instead of falling under the urge to retreat, you'll often catch them off guard.

After you've begun to charge, the demoman will become worried and begin to back off. You want to back off as well. A common reflex of demomen is to plant a sticky at their feet as they retreat and, once again, let their opponent walk right into the trap. If you back off after your initial charge, you'll have avoided the two stickies behind you intended to catch you in retreat as well as the critical sticky before you intended to halt your advance.

Besting a lot of demomen (at least as a soldier!) depends on an initial charge followed by a sudden halt. Afterwards, they will often be either dead or in full retreat.

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Post by mr_s » Tue Jul 29, 2008 5:48 am

[quote="l3eeron";p="104772"]
:rofl:

OMG!!! I almost broke a rib laughing at that! :lol: x 1,000

[/quote]

sames
lol


[/quote][quote="Nick Mame";p="110701"]
Approaching the Sticky-Launcher
When a demoman prone to stickies surprises you in such a way that you have a sudden desire to retreat, you will want to charge the demoman head on. A lot of demomen operate under the principle of, "Why bother to aim when I could have you walk right into a trap?". They'll be launching stickies behind you with the intent of detonating them once you try to retreat. If you charge most demomen instead of falling under the urge to retreat, you'll often catch them off guard.

After you've begun to charge, the demoman will become worried and begin to back off. You want to back off as well. A common reflex of demomen is to plant a sticky at their feet as they retreat and, once again, let their opponent walk right into the trap. If you back off after your initial charge, you'll have avoided the two stickies behind you intended to catch you in retreat as well as the critical sticky before you intended to halt your advance.


[/quote]

Sorry mate, that doesnt quite work on S.

If they retreat i make red goo out of em with stikies, if the charge, i pull me Scrumpy and give em a nice bash on the head

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Re: Hints and Tips for playing TF2

Post by lil Silver » Tue Aug 05, 2008 11:01 pm

If your a spy and your disguised and ure not moving and ure standing in one place people will obviously notice ure either afk in the middle of no where or there going to spy check KEEP MOVING or ure going to end up dead.

Demomen if people are trying to chase you and your like "im going to die" sacrifice your self and plant stickies while ure walking even tho they may get the point for killing you even tho they dident you'll get a point for killing them too.

medics if ure using the kritzkrieg its not the best thing to use cause whoever ure giving the crits to they can still die because there not invincible there just shooting at people and are often valnerable to more attacks from more people. So advice use the original krieg because they become invincible... sry if i dont know the name for the medics thing.



:lol:

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Re: Hints and Tips for playing TF2

Post by Tungsten » Wed Aug 06, 2008 12:00 am

A few quick tips for spies:

-Don't disguise as soon as leaving your spawn!!! I can't stress this enough. Enemy snipers and enemy spies have a chance to see you before you can make it to where your going. The solution? Disguise while cloaked and running towards your objective. It works, really.

-Don't disguise as medics or scouts. If you disguise as a medic and you aren't healing, the enemy will be suspicious. Also, you don't show an uber charge thing. Don't disguise as scout because the speed difference is very noticeable. Disguise as a pyro, sniper, demo or engineer. I rarely ever disguise as anything else.

-If caught in a melee fight, it's better to run backwards and shoot the revolver. The knife has the lowest damage of any melee weapon...well, the scout's bat does less, but he can attack faster. Oh, and when the revolver crits, it crits with power.

Best of luck, but not too much...I don't want a bunch of spies running around.

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