Counter-Strike: Global Offensive

[Bronze Fox]

Counter-Strike has always been like this. It rewards accuracy, aka, headshots.

The tricks you used to ensure accuracy (hold still, crouch, fire singles or bursts and aim a little low to account for recoil) in CS:S and prior are utterly meaningless so far in GO. I watch people spray and pray while running and/or jumping at full speed with at least as good accuracy as I see anyone who actually holds still to try and shoot. It's a joke and I see why I've read so many complaints from avid CS/:S players.

Hm, I've experienced the exact opposite. Which is odd.

I don't know if this has any meaning to you but I thought I would post it.

[Boss Llama]

Counter-Strike has always been like this. It rewards accuracy, aka, headshots.

I agree that it rewards headshots, but disagree that it rewards accuracy. This is mainly because accuracy, in my mind, needs to be controllable or skill based. I can shoot at peoples' feet and headshot them, or I can shoot them point blank in the face with a shotgun and have it miss or count as body shots. The crosshair does not in any way reflect actual bullet spread, and I've watched plenty of people simply spray and pray kill entire groups of crouched/scoped/aiming enemies who are firing back at them, inflicting a combined total of less than 50% damage. While a person certainly gains some advantage by pointing in the general direcetion of a foe before pulling the trigger, I don't think we can call it "accuracy" yet - more like gambling with bullets.

That link is interesting, but I think it makes a negative point about accuracy in the game. That many "standing single shots" aimed, presumably, at the big red square in the middle of the target, yielded not one single hit on said red square. Despite having the gun pointed at the exact same pixel for every shot (again, presumably... the test would have no value if they didn't do this), which is far more precise than any but the most extreme human shooter could possibly do, there is a spread of multiple feet in both directions - horizontally and vertically. This is on a target less than 100 yards away, under firing range conditions. Infantrymen in the Australian army (US has so many standards it makes my head spin) are expected to place groupings smaller than 6 inches at that range.

[Bronze Fox]

Counter-Strike has always been like this. It rewards accuracy, aka, headshots.

I agree that it rewards headshots, but disagree that it rewards accuracy. This is mainly because accuracy, in my mind, needs to be controllable or skill based. I can shoot at peoples' feet and headshot them, or I can shoot them point blank in the face with a shotgun and have it miss or count as body shots. The crosshair does not in any way reflect actual bullet spread, and I've watched plenty of people simply spray and pray kill entire groups of crouched/scoped/aiming enemies who are firing back at them, inflicting a combined total of less than 50% damage. While a person certainly gains some advantage by pointing in the general direcetion of a foe before pulling the trigger, I don't think we can call it "accuracy" yet - more like gambling with bullets.

That link is interesting, but I think it makes a negative point about accuracy in the game. That many "standing single shots" aimed, presumably, at the big red square in the middle of the target, yielded not one single hit on said red square. Despite having the gun pointed at the exact same pixel for every shot (again, presumably... the test would have no value if they didn't do this), which is far more precise than any but the most extreme human shooter could possibly do, there is a spread of multiple feet in both directions - horizontally and vertically. This is on a target less than 100 yards away, under firing range conditions. Infantrymen in the Australian army (US has so many standards it makes my head spin) are expected to place groupings smaller than 6 inches at that range.

But it can be controlled. By crouching, by not moving, by walking instead of running.
Each one of those decreases your crosshair, thus giving you better accuracy.

[Boss Llama]

Crosshair =/= accurate reflection of your bullet spread. It is described as such, but it isn't.

Ask any number of us about having our entire crosshair over the body of a target, with room to spare, and still managing not to hit them. Heck, I've had my entire crosshair over a stationary target's head and not hit them.

Bullet spread in the game is quite insane. A rifle grouping at 10 feet looks like a what you'd expect from buckshot at 50 feet.

[Bronze Fox]

Crosshair =/= accurate reflection of your bullet spread. It is described as such, but it isn't.

Ask any number of us about having our entire crosshair over the body of a target, with room to spare, and still managing not to hit them. Heck, I've had my entire crosshair over a stationary target's head and not hit them.

Bullet spread in the game is quite insane. A rifle grouping at 10 feet looks like a what you'd expect from buckshot at 50 feet.

Ah, there's the problem. You don't view the crosshair as your accuracy.
Well, I don't think there's much more to this debate then.

[Deslock]

Ok, has *anybody* found a server where the cheating/hacking isn't rampant?! It seems like any server I try has at least one person who is either bullet-proof, or could one-shot kill anyone from the far-side of the map with the Glock.
Anyone having better luck?

Part of that may be hacking (it is a problem), but part of it may just be Counterstrike being Counterstrike. Unloading an entire magazine in to a person at point blank and watching the bullets visibly hit them is no guarantee that CS will consider it a valid hit, or that it will actually do damage. The bullet spread, damage amounts, and quite a few other things in the game were programmed by drunken monkies who think things like 9mm and .45 caliber bullets don't hurt people, and that trained professionals will routinely miss an unmoving target 5 feet away, while aiming directly at said target's chest.

I haven't had much in the way of trouble on the eGO server, or on another called something like "The Dog House," though neither upholds our community's standards for non-jerk behavior, language, or conduct. At least people do generally play for the objective, and they're set to Classic Casual. If we have our own server(s) in the future, there'll be nowhere else I want to play

I understand the issue of hits not registering. I'm used to that. What I am talking about is when somebody fires a kill shot as soon as they come into view *regardless* of where you are standing/hiding. *NOBODY* can acquire that fast when they have just entered the area, especially when you are *aiming* at the spot they just appeared in and you can't get a shot off. It's called esp box/aimbot/auto trigger. It is the only way they can know where you are, acquire you, and pull the trigger before you can get off your shot. This is why I hope we can get a community server set up. I have to keep reminding myself that I don't have admin commands on other people's servers.

And I can say that spray-n-pray doesn't work on CS:GO. Aimed shots do much better.
Spray-n-pray was my main tactic in CS:S (P90). I am relearning for CS:GO.

[Bronze Fox]

I understand the issue of hits not registering. I'm used to that. What I am talking about is when somebody fires a kill shot as soon as they come into view *regardless* of where you are standing/hiding. *NOBODY* can acquire that fast when they have just entered the area, especially when you are *aiming* at the spot they just appeared in and you can't get a shot off. It's called esp box/aimbot/auto trigger. It is the only way they can know where you are, acquire you, and pull the trigger before you can get off your shot. This is why I hope we can get a community server set up. I have to keep reminding myself that I don't have admin commands on other people's servers.

And I can say that spray-n-pray doesn't work on CS:GO. Aimed shots do much better.
Spray-n-pray was my main tactic in CS:S (P90). I am relearning for CS:GO.

Radar. If you shoot you'll appear as a red question mark on the enemy's radar that'll then fade away.
If someone on the enemy's team has a visible line of sight on you, you'll appear as a red dot for the enemy's teammates.

Thus the whole concept behind the decoy grenade. (which no one uses)

[Plinko]

I don't know if this has any meaning to you but I thought I would post it.

I am not sure if it holds in Source or GO but in CS the bullet holes also had almost no correlation to the actual hitscan data, they were randomly placed by a separate algorithm on the object that was hit so looking at bullet hole spreads was meaningless.

A better test was to use a grid wall made of a hundred or so separate boxes so you can see which ones actually were hit.

Not to mention the CS:GO spread is simply awful, much worse than the CS:S one!

[Flaming Cheese Wheel]

ISTR something made for CS:S or TF2 (or simply Valve games in general) that consisted of a grid made of breakable objects, so the game would actually have to break them when hit instead of simply applying bullet hole decals.

There was a considerable disassociation between the visual display and the actual results.

Deslock vs. Bronze: Yeah, I call aimbot on that one. The radar question marks can help you get a bearing on the target, but you can't normally zorch people instantly as soon as three pixels' worth of them becomes visible.

In the few hours of GO that I've looked at, I'm leaning toward the good ol' CS "what hit registration?" opinion instead of it rewarding accuracy, though I've also seen people comment that they think the hitboxes are a bit smaller and the registration is better. YMMV.

[Deslock]

I understand the issue of hits not registering. I'm used to that. What I am talking about is when somebody fires a kill shot as soon as they come into view *regardless* of where you are standing/hiding. *NOBODY* can acquire that fast when they have just entered the area, especially when you are *aiming* at the spot they just appeared in and you can't get a shot off. It's called esp box/aimbot/auto trigger. It is the only way they can know where you are, acquire you, and pull the trigger before you can get off your shot. This is why I hope we can get a community server set up. I have to keep reminding myself that I don't have admin commands on other people's servers.

And I can say that spray-n-pray doesn't work on CS:GO. Aimed shots do much better.
Spray-n-pray was my main tactic in CS:S (P90). I am relearning for CS:GO.

Radar. If you shoot you'll appear as a red question mark on the enemy's radar that'll then fade away.
If someone on the enemy's team has a visible line of sight on you, you'll appear as a red dot for the enemy's teammates.

Thus the whole concept behind the decoy grenade. (which no one uses)

In my specific situation, I can rule radar out. Early in the match, I have not fired yet, and nobody from the other team is in the area yet. Also, over the course of the match, I kept changing my location, but the result was the same, and it was the same player every time that got me. As I said, I had to keep reminding myself that I do not have admin commands on other peoples' servers.

[Bronze Fox]

In my specific situation, I can rule radar out. Early in the match, I have not fired yet, and nobody from the other team is in the area yet. Also, over the course of the match, I kept changing my location, but the result was the same, and it was the same player every time that got me. As I said, I had to keep reminding myself that I do not have admin commands on other peoples' servers.

You can still call a vote to kick. If the guy was truly hacking other people should notice as well and the kick should go through then.

[Will T.]

"Play with Friends" has been activated! Valve points out that it is still a bit buggy, but maybe we can arrange Villun matches soon.

[Flash]

"Play with Friends" has been activated! Valve points out that it is still a bit buggy, but maybe we can arrange Villun matches soon.

Finally!

[NerevarineKing]

I would love to play matches with fellow villuns! I apogize ahead of time for being generally terrible at CS.

[Stevo]

TV12