What Defines a "Pro" Player?

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Re: What Defines a "Pro" Player?

Post by Fano » Sun Jan 15, 2012 12:38 am

Kagsacar wrote:After watching the video i came to several conclusions. One, i never want to be on the same content as those people, Two i never ever want to be like them, and three they may have fun, but how often do they go to events like that? i am sure it is not all THAT often, unless they are globe trotting. I have all the respect in the world for those pro, and realizing exactly what a pro actually is, i never want to be one. mainly because i do not want to spend literal years playing the same game. Thanks for all the advice, even if it was just to reinforce something i already knew.
It's an annual event.

I'm not exactly sure how you came to that conclusion, it's not like they spend 12 hours a day playing the game, a couple of hours a night for 3-4 days of the week in the right environment will definitely get you there.

And I think it's a fair assumption to say that a lot of us here play way more often than that.
Last edited by Fano on Sun Jan 15, 2012 1:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What Defines a "Pro" Player?

Post by Kagsacar » Sun Jan 15, 2012 1:08 am

good point, the editing of the video probably helped make them look really nice. Also i have another question, when i do talk to the team, what should i say? i mean i get, that you are supposed to talk about where sentry's are and spy's and such but i feel redundant because normally someone beats me to it already. I also have a problem seeing as how i fit into the picture playing a scout currently...
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Re: What Defines a "Pro" Player?

Post by Fano » Sun Jan 15, 2012 1:29 am

Good practice is just calling out everything you see using the shortest words possible.

Call out the position of the medic, call out if he's hurt so that maybe someone else can get him, do the same with demomen and heavies. Call out sticky traps if you see them, if you catch a player behind your team but are unable to deal with him, say it so that somebody else can deal with it.

e.g. "medic demo choke", "heavy medic on flank", "stickies on cart", "scout behind us"

If you hear an enemy medic say "I am fully charged!" let your team know that the enemy has uber/kritz ready, and suggest that you play a bit defensively until they push in with it, at which time you can make a counter push.
The shortest way to say this is "They called" as in, "their medic called out that he is fully charged."

Things like this will eventually become second nature, the important thing is that you practice talking a lot, no one's gonna care if a certain call is repeated, better to have something called out twice than not at all.
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Re: What Defines a "Pro" Player?

Post by Zork Nemesis » Sun Jan 15, 2012 8:21 am

THE Flying chihuahua wrote:
BETTEH CROCKHURR wrote:Good Teamwork

inb4 essays
I think you mean inb4zork.
Wait, what?
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Re: What Defines a "Pro" Player?

Post by Jesus_Faction » Sun Jan 15, 2012 9:35 am

situational awareness separates the men from the boys imo

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Re: What Defines a "Pro" Player?

Post by Stevo » Sun Jan 15, 2012 11:17 am

Someone who is paid to play.

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Re: What Defines a "Pro" Player?

Post by Peahats » Sun Jan 15, 2012 11:21 am

Stevo wrote:Someone who is paid to play.
"I do not kill out of passion, but for money."

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Re: What Defines a "Pro" Player?

Post by Plinko » Sun Jan 15, 2012 11:54 am

On the 300-hour thing, you've got to keep in mind that this game has been out for over four years now. If you had 300 hours played in 2008, you would have a lot more experience than many, many players. Today, a lot ofplayers have a few thousand hours, so if they're thoughtful players they just have a ton of experience and tricks they've learned that you don't yet have. Short of a surplus of talent, many people out there are going to have an advantage over you one-on-one.

My biggest advice to improve and close that gap would be to work on a few key areas:

1. Make it a goal to survive longer - retreat from or avoid battles where you know you're at a disadvantage - get some health, reload and regroup with your teammates. Surviving longer does a ton to help your team - it also helps you get more productive so less of your next 300 hours are spent waiting to respawn. It's also the first step in a more thoughtful approach to gameplay if you want to get better.
2. Focus on excelling at one or two classes - one "power" class (soldier, demo, heavy) and one of either medic or engie. Leave Scout, Spy and Sniper to learn once you feel extremely comfortable with the game and then learn one of them at a time. It helps a lot to learn one class inside and out, plus between the two categories you should always be able to make a team contribution even if you're not 'pro'.
3. Identify and watch excellent players. Pick up their little good habits and try to emulate them - but pay attention as much to their survival strategies as to their killing the enemy strategies.
4. Envision the game like a soccer or football game - a lot is happening away from 'the ball', start to think about where the focus is and where it is not, can you flank, might you get flanked?
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Re: What Defines a "Pro" Player?

Post by trilobite » Sun Jan 15, 2012 12:09 pm

Sorry for the repetition. Good advice precedes this reply.
More likely is that i am just a idiot who does not bother with teamwork, instead opting to be mute, and charge head first, die, rage-quit.
As others have commented, teamwork, teamwork.
Muting? I do not recommend. There is an abundance of useful information from other players about opposing sentries, spies, heavy/medic combos. You need to be hearing it.
But if you are good enough you can get a few kills in before you die,
In this kind of match, “killing” is not the goal. Capturing the point or defending the point is the goal. Achieve those goals in any way possible. Sometimes it means killing, sometimes not. For example, scouts can quickly capture a point without killing anybody. Or they can be a major distraction while pestering the opposing team. Pyros can be an annoyance by flaming a whole group, but not killing anybody – but creating momentary chaos – and opportunity. So, start imagining the game on a more cerebral level, thinking about how to weave your class’ set of skills into a more sophisticated approach to a match.
For example, when I play pyro on BLU, I die a lot. But in each life I gradually chisel away at RED little-by-little and help advance the front.
Perhaps it is knowing the map, all the load-outs, all the good sentry spots, and so forth.
ABSOLUTELY! Especially knowing where the health packets are… so you become less dependent on medics. Pyor-pyro flamethrower duels are frequently decided in favor of the one pyro who gets the health pack first.
Maybe it is the need to have the twitch reflexes of a nine year old.
For me, the reflex thing is more a function of ping – which changes continuously. When it is low, reflecting rockets is easier. When its high, I don’t even see the rocket and I’m dead. But I don’t blame it on the equipment entirely. Some tricks are just plain hard to do, no matter how much experience you have.
Maybe it is purely based on how well you are doing that particular day, which would make TF2 a terrible terrible game....
Definitely. Sometimes it is the peculiar mix of players on both teams. I don’t know why, but I have the same experience… some days are better than others.
but of my crippling fear of using the built in voice chat function. i really really really REALLY hate using it, and not for any practical reasons, i just do not like talking to people i barely know.
By talking to them, you will get to know them, and they you. But you don’t have to talk to anybody specifically. Here are some examples of general statements that are quick and low risk…
“uber left”, “soldier right”, “sentry down”, “spy is engie”. When starting out, keep your comments short, informative and flat until you get more comfortable to start giving your voice chat more personality. And never ever, ever listen to slutty_pilgrim. He is evil and his voice chats will make you crazy. And slutty, that’s not meant to be personal.
When i use it I get feelings of abject terror every time i open my mouth. I do not know why...
Natural. If you have all team speak voice chat muted, un-mute it and listen to the tone of the voice chat. If you are on a team with regulars, you should perceive it as friendly, playful and forgiving. In my experience, all players, regardless of experience, contributing useful information are accepted. Sometimes, there are critical and judgmental statements, but they are usually global, not targeting individual players – except maybe hewasaFLUTE.
And because my typing is abysmal, and slow, that is out of the question.
I almost never read the text chat during a match – which can be frustrating to some of my team players who are trying to communicate to me. I think your bandwidth is much broader using team speak.
I also tend to switch classes almost constantly which may be a determent.
Constant switching might be a problem. But it’s reasonable to switch to be more effective. I support the recommendation to pick one or two classes that you like and stick with those classes. Some aspects of each class are organic, skills that only come with continuous experience.
So how does one become a "pro" player? Teamwork? Brute force practice? I would like to know...
It depends on what you mean by, “pro.” If you want to be “proficient,” pick two or three of your favorite classes. Practice these classes offline (use the “create your own server” option). Not all maps have active bots, but many do. Become familiar with these maps. Practice your skills on BLU and RED. Try out different tricks.
This game is full of tradeoffs. There is no single formula for success. You will always experience some mix of success and failure. Your work is to find the best mix of success/failure that gives you the most gratification.
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Re: What Defines a "Pro" Player?

Post by bluntspoon » Sun Jan 15, 2012 1:01 pm

Your favorite weapon is a sword that can't be deselected and your most played map is Warpath. I don't know a single person who could succeed with that combination.

Pick a class and focus on that. You play medic a bunch so perhaps start there. Friend Soltan, Barcode, Crusty, Oldman (both of them) and few other highly placed medics and play on their servers when possible. Study how they play and see what works for you. Everyone is different.
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Re: What Defines a "Pro" Player?

Post by Bronze Fox » Sun Jan 15, 2012 1:01 pm

Or, or! You can do what I do and just play Scout. That way you're exempt from having to work with your team.
It's a crafty plan that I have perfected throughout my career.
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Re: What Defines a "Pro" Player?

Post by Earthworm James » Sun Jan 15, 2012 1:34 pm

Technically, I used to be a "Pro" Counter-Strike player. That being said...

I quit competitive gaming in 2006 after my last & largest tournament. Why? I did & found what it takes to be the best, and my conclusion is that it really just takes time. The best of the best play all day every day. If a player plays 12 hours a day with focus & intention than they can be on fire & precise. The only way to beat that is to be just as on your game as they are. Having to put that much time into a game creates a very undesirable lifestyle IMO. It turns into something EVEN MORE of a grind than WoW(or your worst MMO experience).
Teamwork & communication are the foundation for a Pro gamer, but individual ability is what gets each individual player to the top. Extrememely skilled players have an extreme affect on any server they join. I personally found, in the end, that the dream of it all wasn't worth the time necessary to achieve my goals. Sure, traveling the world playing video games sounds pretty frickin awesome, but it is much more tedious than it appears on the surface.

CSS said it best.
crimsonshootingstar wrote:Congratulations you have now removed the game from the game and made it a profession. You are a pro. You are well on your way to being the next Johnathan Wendel and are disenvited from pax for all eternity..
I met the guy(or saw him at CPL several times), and yes, he is a huge ass(he goes the extra 4 hours and plays 16 hours a day).
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Re: What Defines a "Pro" Player?

Post by MateoTheBold! » Sun Jan 15, 2012 3:07 pm

Honestly to become a pro player, the Ville might not be the best resource. I think most of us are geared towards having fun and not taking ourselves too seriously.

To refocus your question slightly to one of "how do you improve in TF2 after hitting a skill wall", I noticed that once I branched out into classes I considered the most difficult, I started to improve quite a bit as a player. I even found that understanding how to play alternative classes really helped me play my initial favorites even better.

Just don't forget that TF2 should never be a chore or a grind...if you ever find that you aren't having fun, reexamine what your goals for the game are or take a break it for a while!
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Re: What Defines a "Pro" Player?

Post by Kagsacar » Sun Jan 15, 2012 3:14 pm

Ok i think i used a bit to broad a statement for what i wanted. What i want is to be able to play with my teammates without feeling like i am slowing the entire process down. I want to be able to get a few kills in before i inevitably die. But above all i want to have fun. I have been focusing on one class since yesterday, and i do like this method more than constant class swapping. I am liking the scout the best, because i do have the reflexes for the speed the scout operates at. This has been rather helpful. Thank you.
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Re: What Defines a "Pro" Player?

Post by One_Medic_Army » Sun Jan 15, 2012 3:23 pm

Don't worry too much about getting kills.
I'm happy any time I can manage a kill to death ratio of better than 1, or better than .25 for medic.
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