Hatless Update

[Flobee]

Perhaps the worst update I have seen since I joined TF2 back in October.

And that's saying a lot.

what

this is fantastic! we've been needing a good bug fix + change + buff/nerf update for a while now!

[KajiVena]

Perhaps the worst update I have seen since I joined TF2 back in October.

And that's saying a lot.

what

this is fantastic! we've been needing a good bug fix + change + buff/nerf update for a while now!

Did you notice how half of Engineers Wrenches and Demoman's Swords are now pointless?

Or how the Powerjack got nerfed to oblivion?

Sure, the non-balance parts of the update were good but I prefer to look at the actual gameplay-changing aspects of an update.

Fists of Steel got overnerfed like Natascha.
Mad Milk is fine now.
Battalion's Backup is still good.
The Sydney Sleep promotes bad play even more now.
Wrenches are now all outclassed by the base Wrench and Jag.
Swords are now all straight downgrades to Half-Zatoichi.
Edit: Loch'n'Load now has enough damage to kill an overhealed Heavy. If you can hit him. IF.

Need I go on?


EDIT: http://www.teamfortress.com/hatless/

At the bottom of the page.

Something some people will really like.

[black_and_blue]

we've been needing a good bug fix...update for a while now!

Ah yes, the good bug fix update that crashes the server every 40 minutes, my client every 10 minutes, and completely breaks the item system for everyone! Exactly what we've been needing!

[matt101]

hahaha

[Fano]

it was horribly underpowered before.

now it's a bit better, but not having rollers + a halved clip is still too much of a downside.

hahahahahahahaha

i'm sorry i just cannot understand how the loch n load was underpowered

i get more kills and destructions with it than i ever did with the regular grenade launcher.

what advantages does the loch-n-load give over the grenade launcher?

the regular grenade launcher has double the clip, not to mention rollers are incredibly powerful and can help hold down chokepoints via spam & splash damage

the loch'n'load now has the ability to one shot 125 HP classes, provided that you can actually hit them, but the increased demand on accuracy + the increased reloading time thanks to the smaller clip means that missing is a much bigger penalty than on the regular launcher.

the increased travel speed for the grenades doesn't mean much, IMO.


===
in other news, I don't know why everyone is flipping out over the melee changes, it's not like it's common to get into a melee fight with somebody, and in the case you do you probably shouldn't have been using one of the weapons that was mentioned in the update anyway.

I'm just glad that we'll be seeing less demoknights in favor of the more useful DEMOLITION MAN (you know, the guy that makes things explode)

[Cpt._Keyes]

its quite easy to hit with the loch n load...the splash does more than the roller damage splash...so in choke points you have more damage, and people cant avoid them like they do rollers...just aim at a big chunky target...lob your two in...and you do significant damage to them and others around, and the reload time is reduced so that you are still spending the same amount of shooting and reload time to compensate for the smaller clip, you just do it shorter more often...rather than longer less often

[Zork Nemesis]

My record multi-kill was with a Loch-n-Load shell, a crit from one obliterated an entire point defense of 5 people and a sentry. People saying it's underpowered because misses are completly trashed need to practice with it I think. Sure, being able to roll and bounce them helps a lot in some cases, but there's lots of other applications for it. The damn thing can take down sentries faster than stickies and DH rockets; and usually kills the engy in the process at that.

I won't trade my loch-n-load back for the vanilla, and now that it's got more kick behind it, you better hide behind those concrete barriers.

[Cpt._Keyes]

i have to say though...i think the loch n load group might be biased http://stats.theville.org/hlstats.php?m ... ad&game=tf


but yes, I seriously dont need to uber against a lvl 3, just pop your two shells and its gone along with anything else that might have been camping around the sentry

[grover]

oh gog, they buffed the loch n load?

but I thought it was strong enough to begin with!

oh well, guess I'll just start owning everybody that little bit harder haha.

Flobee...I live in fear of you.

Also. I had to type in 20 some odd passwords to get in here.

Hi, guys!!

[Flaming Cheese Wheel]

:waves:

[Katotsu]

Did you notice how half of Engineers Wrenches and Demoman's Swords are now pointless?

This update might get me to start using the Southern Hospitality.

[One_Medic_Army]

This update might get me to use the eyelander, so far I have a terrible track record hitting people with charges or increased demo range.
With eyelander able to crit I can at least count on dumb, blind luck.
Also definitely going to use Lock n Load as default now, it just gave me every incentive to improve my aim.
As to the half-zatoichi, it's now even more comparatively overpowered in melee only, but the honourbound downside hurts hideously in actual play. Glad they fixed the crits.
Vita-saw able to see enemy health, might actually pull it out occasionally now.
Powerjack needed that nerf to be honest.
Backburner is now much improved.
Flaregun change makes me >:D

All the things this update broke on the servers makes me >:(

[edit]Sydney Sleeper: as someone who plays a 150hp class about 50% of the time, I'm not really thrilled about this change making it even easier for me to randomly die in one bodyshot.

[Zork Nemesis]

I do acctually disagree with some of the melee weapon changes, in particular

The Powerjack's damage is now equal to that of the fire axe. This in place of the 'no random crits' defeats the purpose of using the vanilla axe, similar to how the Amputator practically nullifies the vanilla bonesaw. As many people won't melee a pyro to begin with, it's added melee vunerability doesn't do much good to counter that.

The Eyelander, Headtaker, and Claidheameh Mor's ability to random crit now somewhat defeats the purpose of the targe. While the targe still guarentee's a critical, the synergy between the two weapons was what made them so great. While it's still rather pointless to use the Claidheameh Mor without it, The Eyelander and Headtaker are now much more of potential options with the sticky launcher, as a 140 random crit can still cleave through a lightweight class and collect heads.

The Caber goes both ways for me, while I do agree with reducing the damage, I only think the explosion should've taken the hit, as a critical explosion plus critical hit before would do over 400 damage. When exploded before this patch, the remains of the caber were as powerful as the bat, now they're even weaker. Random crits or not, this fact alone ruins the caber's use post explosion as a crit only does 80 damage now. The explosion does 225 on a critical, combined with a charge it can still kill a heavy who isn't being healed, but it can't just wreck overhealed heavies anymore, and i'm fine with that. It's after the fact that bugs me.

The Gunslinger didn't need this to happen, I feel they could've had this one if they had just looked at the combo attack again and made it more responsive (i've chased people and landed 5 consecuitive blows without a critical before). While I usually don't melee with the gunslinger, cutting it's damage somewhat ruins close up survivability when the shotgun is out. I'd like to see this one reverted, and if you must do something, go ahead and remove the combo kills if you really have to.

As for the Southern Hospitality, this can be compared to the Tribalman's Shiv now. Keep in mind when the shiv was first released, it could still random crit, it's penalty was 35% less damage though. Despite this change, the SH still puts out more damage than the wrench or jag in one swing. As opposed to the shiv, the extra 25% damage in this case is offset by the fire vunerability. Not a bad tradeoff, and I do agree with this one. It's the ONLY one I agree with.

My other thoughts

Vita-Saw: Wasn't entirely nessicary, but a neat perk. Allows a medic to select targets for his paitent. But the 10 health penalty is too little for that kind of perk in my opinion

Fists of Steel: I agree with both factors. Yes, it helps a heavy get through a sniper-heavy area, but many people did use it to troll, I can think of several people who packed it with the shotgun and were able to demolish groups because when the group pulled melee, the heavy pulled his shotgun.

Loch-n-Load: Yes

Equalizer: We should've all seen this coming, crits from less than 50 health were still capable of dealing well over 300 damage, a fact that should remain on explosives and backstabs. But still no real offset to the vanilla shovel.

Backburner: I know what the backburner was good for, it was meant for Pyros who knew how to ambush. It doesn't exactly need the airblast, but if it will make more people consider it, let it be so. The four airblast limit isn't so bad though, it means you have to think before you burst, as it chews up ammo super fast.

Sydney Sleeper: About the comment about bad sniper encouragement, no. Look past the whole bodyshot factor and see that this is a support weapon, it is not meant to encourage anything. It's for snipers who want to help their team. Yes, it can't kill as fast as the standard rifle, but it allows a skillful sniper to 'paint' targets for his team, especially if said sniper has bad aim to begin with (see myself for example). Boosting it's charge allows it to get to the required 50% faster so that the sniper can paint more often. Plus, if you're only concerned about headshots, keep in mind that over half of the classes have 150 health or less, meaning they'll die anyway if you hit them in the shoulder or groien. Plus, when you miss a headshot on the rifle, there's nothing stopping the person from continuing if they survive except a profusely bleeding wound. If they get covered in yellow stuff along with said wound, they may think before proceeding forward, and instead fall back allowing your team to move up in his stead.

There, I said it.

[Fano]

the sydney sleeper is actually pretty damn powerful now.

the charge is so much faster that you can dish out 150 damage bodyshots in mere seconds, not to mention it is much easier to aim, the sniper set is now pretty overpowered if you ask me.

the standard rifle is still a lot more fun though, nothing can compare to quick scoping a scout for a quick 150 damage headshot from 5 feet away.

[One_Medic_Army]

the sydney sleeper is actually pretty damn powerful now.

the charge is so much faster that you can dish out 150 damage bodyshots in mere seconds, not to mention it is much easier to aim, the sniper set is now pretty overpowered if you ask me.

the standard rifle is still a lot more fun though, nothing can compare to quick scoping a scout for a quick 150 damage headshot from 5 feet away.

I really, REALLY wish they'd change the full charge bodyshot damage to less than 150, nothing like knowing that any mediocre sniper with a few seconds can insta-gib you at any time when you're playing a medic.
I am sure that my medic K:D will become much worse now, between all the people playing pyro and pee rifle sniper in the near future. Might convince me to use the vita-saw.