Q3F Last resort?

[bullet4o1]

I'm kinda tempted to start mapping again. I did it a little for Q3F for fun.

I loved this map a lot and found that no one ported it yet.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DoaLkVR8wYU

This is the only video I can find so I will probably have to fire up the good ole Q3F to look at it again.


What do you guys think? Would it be worth to make?

[l3eeron]

I have never played Quake, the closets thing I have played is TFC.


...you are talking about Quake right?





Anyways, I love looking at old maps for inspiration. (hence avantiville ) It seems their general lay out is always solid, and maybe only needs few minor tweaks. I'd be willing to collaborate on something with you....


I'm good at construction/entity ins/outs/optimization, and poor at layout. I do how ever want to do a map in the swamp theme very badly, seen HERE and am looking for an excuse to dive into a TF2 map.

[Archon]

[quote="l3eeron";p="228546"] and poor at layout.[/quote]

noob, layout is the easy part

[bullet4o1]

[flash width=425 height=355]http://www.youtube.com/v/Qy_N94wWS5Y&hl=en[/flash]

I suck at youtube videos

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qy_N94wWS5Y

[mr_s]

wtf?

quake 3 fortress? :S

[bullet4o1]

Yes Quake 3 Fortress!

That is the very first Fortress game I played. 56k dialup ftw!


The game is now free. We should make a Q3F server and play sometime.


Every class had primary and secondary grenades. It was nuts.

[bullet4o1]

So do you guys think this could be TF2afied?

[Plinko]

I never played Q3F, I played a bit of Q3DM and a bit of a couple interesting mods - Superheroes and Q3Pong which was a neat predecessor to Cube Soccer.

[sgt stutter]

[quote="mr_s";p="228613"]quake 3 fortress? :S[/quote]

Before Team Fortress Classic there was Team Fortress, a 1996 QuakeWorld mod. TF's developers were working on Team Fortress 2 as a standalone game, but later joined Valve Software and ported the original as a mod for Half-Life called Team Fortress Classic in April 1999. Despite the company's 1998 statement that Team Fortress 2: Brotherhood of Arms would be released "soon," the game remained in development of one form or another for eight years until its release on 10 October 2007, and had been on Wired magazine's top ten vaporware list every year since 2001.

[mr_s]

[quote="sgt stutter";p="228873"]
[quote="mr_s";p="228613"]quake 3 fortress? :S[/quote]

Before Team Fortress Classic there was Team Fortress, a 1996 QuakeWorld mod. TF's developers were working on Team Fortress 2 as a standalone game, but later joined Valve Software and ported the original as a mod for Half-Life called Team Fortress Classic in April 1999. Despite the company's 1998 statement that Team Fortress 2: Brotherhood of Arms would be released "soon," the game remained in development of one form or another for eight years until its release on 10 October 2007, and had been on Wired magazine's top ten vaporware list every year since 2001.
[/quote]

yeah i know that... but quake 3 team fortress? lol

there was a quake 3 team arena, and that was alright

[dredfox]

[quote="bullet4o1";p="228657"]So do you guys think this could be TF2afied?[/quote]

Somebody asked for an opinion and I have no shortage of those. So here we go.

First impression: It seems a bit open in places. The open areas at 0:30 and 0:40 seem like pyros, medics, and heavies would get torn up by snipers. The spot at 0:40 reminds me of CTF_Well. Overall though, the map seems to be a horrible fusion of Mach4 and DoubleCross. I'm not saying the map is bad or it isn't worth attempting, however it does appear to be badly optimized for TF2.

<textwall>

• Pyros would need some reasonable amount of cover to get into the sewer areas, otherwise spies would have few restrictions on movement. This may not be an issue, but I felt it was worth mentioning
• Some cover above walkways might be a good idea or soldiers and demos could rain down hellfire on most of those sections. Converting some outdoor walkways into hallways might be a partial solution, but that may make the map closed in, ruining some of its charm. As an alternative, find a way to make soldiers and demos particularly vulnerable while airborn; sentry friendly spots that cover the sky but not the walkway might be one solution.
• I'm not familiar with the overall layout, but the lower areas might be best used as a penalty area for most classes. I'm thinking of heavies and scouts in Mach4 that have an easy time being airblasted into the pit, but are less useful in the confined space, and must travel through risky areas to quickly climb back up.
• The rooms are so large looking that part of me wants to say, "Just drop some crates here and some barrels there for cover." I think that might clutter them up though without addressing the underlying problem. The flag room might benefit from railing and a sunken center like in Turbine, or perhaps a few pillars or platforms, or even a walkway around the perimeter that can't be accessed (easily) from the floor.
• CTF maps seem particularly difficult to balance. If you make the flag too easy to capture, you risk the all powerful scout rush. If the journey across the map is too dangerous, you risk the turtle strategy and stagnant gameplay. Have you considered modifying it for a 3 or 5 cp map?
• Final suggestion: When in doubt, add risks, not restrictions.

[bullet4o1]

Thanks for your input Dredfox! That's what I like to hear. Hmm maybe to make this work we should scale down the overall side of the rooms? I'm sure there would be a fudge factor and not make it exactly like the Q3f version. Because both games are completely different in play. As far as layout goes, do you think it would be viable to pursue?

[Masakari]

[quote="Archon";p="228558"]
[quote="l3eeron";p="228546"] and poor at layout.[/quote]

noob, layout is the easy part
[/quote]Haha, agreed! In my case, I enjoy looking at layout (Google SketchUp was a godsend!), but as it is right now I have a map that's fully laid out, it just need detailing, and I've procrastinated massively on it. I'm just not overly impressed with myself.

[dredfox]

[quote="bullet4o1";p="228935"]Thanks for your input Dredfox! That's what I like to hear. Hmm maybe to make this work we should scale down the overall side of the rooms? I'm sure there would be a fudge factor and not make it exactly like the Q3f version. Because both games are completely different in play. As far as layout goes, do you think it would be viable to pursue?[/quote]

This seems to be salvageable, but the end result will be more a product of your creativity than a 1:1 copy. Looking at this map I get the feeling that Q3F was more like Unreal Tournament than TF2. The layout lends itself to fast reflexive play rather than team organization. Playing UT3 I would frequently go toe to toe with an opponent until one of us ran away or died. In TF2 a medic going up against a soldier is as good as dead.

You may want to start by drawing the layout as a flowchart with areas linked and then design from there. If you copy this map and try to change things until it fits TF2, you may go mad.

One last brainstormed idea that doesn't fit anywhere. Can you conceive of a way to change those canals into elevated overpasses? This might preserve the overall layout while fixing the "fish in a barrel" danger of an open canal. The bridges could still extend over a shorter pit or pond with nearby ladders or stairs; something like the canals/moats in Well. It would be just enough to be a hazard without being a deathtrap.

[bullet4o1]

Good ideas. Maybe it's something worth pursuing then. I don't have a ton of time but I might start casually work on it.

I could maybe develop this into a swamp theme with ya beeron. I'll try to play with it this weekend.