Weapon Criticisms

[Agro]

the stupid huntsman.
shoot randomly over the ridge and hope for kills, shoot randomly down the tunnel and hope someone runs into it, shoot in the spot you think the person is running to and hope that the hit boxes are big enough for the shot to register and that the person runs into it (talking about long range).
some of the huntsman kills are legitimate (maybe 10% are shots where they actually are aiming to kill the person that gets killed) though, but those aren't the ones that piss me off.

[Fano]

I'm still waiting on somebody to describe a situation to me in which the shovel has an advantage over the equalizer.

if you're pulling out melee during an uber you're just doing it wrong.

[TheCarpe]

If you use the Buff Banner or Battalions Backup you have four shots to work with. If the enemy is nearby, it makes more sense to use the shovel than waste precious uber time to reload a rocket.

[Fano]

If you use the Buff Banner or Battalions Backup you have four shots to work with. If the enemy is nearby, it makes more sense to use the shovel than waste precious uber time to reload a rocket.

I would prefer to reload a rocket. which does 100+ damage and I don't have to be hugging the enemy in order for it to be effective.

in reality though, it makes more sense to load another rocket and jump away before the uber fades so that both you and your medic get out safely, don't be a hero.

also, that is a hell of a lot more situational than having a weapon you can draw anytime when low on health to run to the nearest health kit, which happens a lot more often.

Better in some instances but not all. It really just ends up on how you weigh the pros and cons.
It's just a fact of life, basically an axiom, that everyone will look at something differently.
Sure, there will be a majority, but also a minority.

I think the stock flamethrower better suits my play-style, while most will believe the Degreaser better suits theirs.

Can you elaborate on how exactly the flamethrower better suits your play-style?

[crimsonshootingstar]

I don't do weapon switches mid combat. Its not hardwired into my brain because I come from normal shooters where you don't have to. So there the basic flamer does have a slight advantage.

Also while I will agree that I would reload the launcher over going mellee. the jumping away to save your self bit seems very silly. That is two good shots you could have taken while still ubered and at least another two before you get smoked. If you die you respawn in like 15 seconds tops. Playing the hero is what its all about especially when it comes to your teams hard earned ubercharges. Take out everything you can that blocks your teams way and if you die so be it.

[Fano]

I don't do weapon switches mid combat. Its not hardwired into my brain because I come from normal shooters where you don't have to. So there the basic flamer does have a slight advantage.

Also while I will agree that I would reload the launcher over going mellee. the jumping away to save your self bit seems very silly. That is two good shots you could have taken while still ubered and at least another two before you get smoked. If you die you respawn in like 15 seconds tops. Playing the hero is what its all about especially when it comes to your teams hard earned ubercharges. Take out everything you can that blocks your teams way and if you die so be it.

the jumping away bit is situational, usually it's enough to just start backing up with reloading rockets, but if a quick getaway is needed then the option is there.

I like to emphasize jumping because I see so few soldiers do it, and it's such a powerful tool to have T_T

[TheCarpe]

I never said it was a reason to use it over the Equalizer, you asked for a situation where it's better, and I gave you one

Once again you're trying to compare comp play to pub play and you simply can't. I don't do self-preservation. I hurt people. When I uber, I go in and I do as much damage as I can, and continue to do so until I die. Fleeing is not in my nature. I can reign havoc for several more seconds after the Uber wears off, and I'd rather kill enemies than leave them to heal.

[Fano]

it really isn't much different though. TF2 is TF2. I've incorporated several strategies that I've learned from playing 6v6/9v9 (both are great ways to play and expand your horizons and I highly recommend people to try it out) and my skill has increased considerably.

self-preservation allows you to stay alive longer to hurt people more, as a soldier my main goal before I get out alive is that my medic gets out alive so that he can keep the rest of the team buffer and begin charging his next uber faster, and pulling out my melee in the middle of an uber doesn't really help there.

it also doesn't help if I'm dead, because then my medic is alone and might not find another pocket before an enemy soldier jumps on him.

[Bronze Fox]

Better in some instances but not all. It really just ends up on how you weigh the pros and cons.
It's just a fact of life, basically an axiom, that everyone will look at something differently.
Sure, there will be a majority, but also a minority.

I think the stock flamethrower better suits my play-style, while most will believe the Degreaser better suits theirs.

Can you elaborate on how exactly the flamethrower better suits your play-style?

Um, I generally like to set people on fire, and let the afterburn hurt them. Instead of setting someone on fire and running in there with the Axtinguisher.
That's my play-style, I like to stay back as Pyro.

And Fano, I don't think you understand, I don't mind dieing. It's just a game, deaths don't matter
I just don't take the game as seriously as you I guess. I play for fun.

[Guardian]

self-preservation allows you to stay alive longer to hurt people more, as a soldier my main goal before I get out alive is that my medic gets out alive so that he can keep the rest of the team buffer and begin charging his next uber faster, and pulling out my melee in the middle of an uber doesn't really help there.

This.

Learning how to survive in a tough situation is almost as important as learning to kill, people seem to forget that. Playing smart is always preferable to suicide charging... unless you can kill the medic

[Plinko]

Under fast respawn, the game is very, very different than standard spawn, low player comp play - if you say it's not you're nuts.
The value of surviving plummets and the value of even any small chance at delaying the opponent for a bit rises significantly in 24-32 player fast respawn.
It may be good for your kill:death ratio but it is not necessarily useful to team objectives.

[trunicated]

Under fast respawn, the game is very, very different than standard spawn, low player comp play - if you say it's not you're nuts.
The value of surviving plummets and the value of even any small chance at delaying the opponent for a bit rises significantly in 24-32 player fast respawn.
It may be good for your kill:death ratio but it is not necessarily useful to team objectives.

Exactly. Going in and taking someone with your 25% of the time with a 4 second respawn and a L3 teleporter is much better than throwing away 6-8 seconds to run away and take nobody.

But that completely changes on a 12-16 second respawn server. It even changes if you don't have teleporters up. As I said before, every situation is different, and even with all the maps and servers on TheVille, there's still tons of other situations that us as individual players don't run into or don't recognize when we do run into them.

Just as Carpe said above about the equalizer/shovel... he stated a specific time when using a shovel would help his playstyle. Every weapon, even the old ones, have a use. I for one prefer the scatter gun to the FaN and Shortstop, and the BONK! to the pistol. But that's due to my playstle and the various situations when I like to play scout.

[MrBlah]

if you're pulling out melee during an uber you're just doing it right.

also, that is a hell of a lot more situational than having a weapon you can draw anytime when low on health to run and melee kill your unassuming opponent

Fixed

[Fano]

Better in some instances but not all. It really just ends up on how you weigh the pros and cons.
It's just a fact of life, basically an axiom, that everyone will look at something differently.
Sure, there will be a majority, but also a minority.

I think the stock flamethrower better suits my play-style, while most will believe the Degreaser better suits theirs.

Can you elaborate on how exactly the flamethrower better suits your play-style?

Um, I generally like to set people on fire, and let the afterburn hurt them. Instead of setting someone on fire and running in there with the Axtinguisher.
That's my play-style, I like to stay back as Pyro.

This is fine, but do realize that the afterburn has already been nerfed to the point where the degreaser's "-25% afterburn damage" means 1 less damage per tick. resulting in 45 damage done instead of 60 if the player burns for the full duration, which is unlikely now as damn near every class can put out fire >_<

And Fano, I don't think you understand, I don't mind dieing. It's just a game, deaths don't matter
I just don't take the game as seriously as you I guess. I play for fun.

Let's not pull out the fun-hater argument on me, ok? I have a lot more fun being alive at the front lines than waiting even the 3-5 seconds it takes to respawn on theville servers, not to mention I've been playing on normal respawn servers lately and waiting 20 seconds to respawn just isn't worth the lulz of suiciding on the enemy and not accomplishing anything.




also, I'm not saying the game isn't different in comp vs pub, it takes a hell of a lot more coordination to play 6v6. My point was that I've been able to apply

[TheCarpe]

The bottom line in all of this is that the beauty of Team Fortress has always been in it's ability to cater to just about any type of playstyle. There is no right or wrong weapon or strategy that fits everyone. Find how you like to play, and with what, and run with it. To hell with what other people say. You paid for the game just like they did, you're just as entitled to having fun your way (within reason) as they are.

I have fun charging in and going down in a blaze of glory and setting as many people alight as I can.

Fano prefers caution and self-preservation so he can keep fighting longer.

Bronze uses the weapons in his loadout because they work for him.

None of us are wrong. We just know what our kind of fun is, and choose to play that way.

That's all.