Borderlands

[Bakuryu]

Some friends and I are going to be buying it. I thought it looked cool, sort of reminds me of Hellgate: London. Any thoughts on it?

[BigBiker05]

Thats exactly what I thought of it as.

It actually looked cool, but when I watched the dev's trailor it turned me off. They made it look really stupid.

[Cool Guy]

Im getting the game and whould like to know who else is getting it.

[VII]

Thinking about pre-ordering this along with L4D. Neat concept for a FPS. I can't make up my mind as there's too many games to pick up for this upcoming winter!

[Kabookie]

I'm buying it, and three of my friends are buying it also.

[eraD]

Pre-ordered it on Steam. Can't wait for it to come out.

[!B a T m A n!]

it reminds me of fallout.. but with cars.. and stuff .. lol

[Araris]

I made a sizeable Steam purchase tonight (Dragon Age Origins CE, and Left 4 Dead 2) and I've always been really impressed with Borderlands. It's just that the developer behind it has had hit and misses before. I was about to pre-order it then read that IGN is going to put up their PC Borderlands review Monday morning so I'll wait till then. If it scores 8.5 or higher I'll buy it (normally I don't base my decision on reviews but I'm thinking it'll help push me over the fence).

[UncannyGarlic]

http://www.giantbomb.com/quick-look-bor ... s/17-1498/
The above gameplay footage with narration is the best view of the game I've seen so far. It's ~30 minutes but it seems like it should give a good glimpse into what the game is. It's on my watch list but I'm not sold on it yet (not that I think my computer could handle it). It seems pretty much like a FPS Diablo II but I see a number of problems and possible problems with it. Here is what basically came to mind when I watched that video:

• Difficulty - Multiplayer looks too easy, it might just be because it's at the beginning of the game. Singleplayer I'm not sure about, he died in second play-through game but it seemed like his main weapon was too weak for where he was (based on his pistol seemingly dealing out damage faster). If it has adjustable difficulty levels I'll be pleased.
• Only four different classes. Pretty limited gameplay variation, even more so given that the max party size is also four and the next two items listed.
• Only one activated skill per class. I guess they were trying to keep it simple and wanted to focus on how you change that skill but having only one seems limited and prone to becoming repetitive and boring.
• Small skill trees. From what I could see in the video, it looked like the skill tree might be on the small side. Borderlands appears to only have 21 skills per class while Diablo II (henceforth D2) had 30.
• In multiplayer, players can be revived by just clicking on them. This could make things too easy and I'm curious whether or not they get the money penalty for being revived in that way (I'm guessing not).
• On the second playthrough it seemed like the enemies had too much health but that might be due to his gun being underpowered (his other weapons seemed like it was more reasonable). I prefer big, soft mobs with a few buff creatures (ala D2) to simply a few buff creatures (in a FPS, it seems like it would get boring).
• The explanations for "magical" abilities on items being a hint rather than a de.scription. This would be good for a hardcore RPG, especially if you could add notes to the item but in an ARPG it seems out of place.
• Are levels randomly generated or randomly selected from a database? If not then this also hurts replayability.
• Good - You can reallocate points (costs money), a necessary feature and something D2 lacked.

[eraD]

[quote="UncannyGarlic";p="203298"]
[*]Good - You can reallocate points (costs money), a necessary feature and something D2 lacked.[/list][/quote]

I always liked that about Diablo. I just enjoy making many characters with different builds I guess.

[UncannyGarlic]

[quote="eraD";p="203332"]I always liked that about Diablo. I just enjoy making many characters with different builds I guess.[/quote]
I get a lot of enjoyment out of making characters with different builds. I get no enjoyment out of having to grind every character of the same class with a different build up from zero. The game doesn't have enough variety for that (in D2, there is arguably enough to do every class once) and it just plain eats up time. Why shouldn't the player be allowed to pay to reallocate stat points? Does it make the game more fun to lock players into their choices when they had minimal knowledge and no experience when they started? What makes sense in a RPG, especially one with multiple paths for different builds, isn't always to make sense for a linear ARPG, especially when it comes to designing character builds.

It's like limited inventory space in ARPGs, the only reason that it's there is because it was in Rogue (where it had a place). Does it add anything to the game to have to micromanage items, going back to town every 15-30 minutes so that you can sell your junk and continue exploring, fighting, looting, and gaining experience? (Diablo based) ARPG developers need to take a page out of JRPG developers' books when it comes to inventories.

[eraD]

[quote="UncannyGarlic";p="203551"][quote="eraD";p="203332"]I always liked that about Diablo. I just enjoy making many characters with different builds I guess.[/quote]
I get a lot of enjoyment out of making characters with different builds. I get no enjoyment out of having to grind every character of the same class with a different build up from zero. The game doesn't have enough variety for that (in D2, there is arguably enough to do every class once) and it just plain eats up time. Why shouldn't the player be allowed to pay to reallocate stat points? Does it make the game more fun to lock players into their choices when they had minimal knowledge and no experience when they started? What makes sense in a RPG, especially one with multiple paths for different builds, isn't always to make sense for a linear ARPG, especially when it comes to designing character builds.

It's like limited inventory space in ARPGs, the only reason that it's there is because it was in Rogue (where it had a place). Does it add anything to the game to have to micromanage items, going back to town every 15-30 minutes so that you can sell your junk and continue exploring, fighting, looting, and gaining experience? (Diablo based) ARPG developers need to take a page out of JRPG developers' books when it comes to inventories.[/quote]

I wasn't saying they shouldn't add it, I think it is fine that they added it in. I just won't be using it, but I have no problem if other people play differently than me.

The inventory in Borderlands is pretty big (42 slots if you fix all the Claptraps), and each gun only takes up one slot. I think the inventory system, from what I've seen, is fine.

[UncannyGarlic]

[quote="eraD";p="203589"]I wasn't saying they shouldn't add it, I think it is fine that they added it in. I just won't be using it, but I have no problem if other people play differently than me.[/quote]
I generally try to plan out my builds pretty exactly but sometimes the lack of information on a skill or how it actually works makes me wish I had used points elsewhere. It's also nice to just be able to experiment/screw around with different builds, especially at high level. I also wasn't accusing you of saying that they shouldn't have it in but rather challenging your (and some game developers) thinking. Some things just don't make any sense to deny to the player but I'm all for options like Iron Man mode that make the game harder and/or more like how games used to be made. Hell, part of the need for a restat option is simply the fact that games are longer, both in terms of time (which when not coupled with the following tends to be bad design) and content, than they used to be.

Why don't you like to restat by the way, just for the added challenge?

[quote="eraD";p="203589"]The inventory in Borderlands is pretty big (42 slots if you fix all the Claptraps), and each gun only takes up one slot. I think the inventory system, from what I've seen, is fine.[/quote]
Yeah, it seemed plenty big from the gameplay video I linked to earlier but playing the game is the real test. I was just using that as an example of something which is currently a chronic problem. Games have been getting better about it as they move away from copying Diablo's inventory (it was a huge issue in both games) but it's still around as a problem.

[Grapedrink]

mancannon and I are both getting this, along with 2 other friends of mine if anyone would like to play

[eraD]

I'm not sure why I don't like to respec, I guess I just got used to it in Diablo and other ARPG's. I would like to see a "Hardcore" mode, where if you die once, you die for good. I loved that in Hellgate.

I will admit Diablo's inventory was tiny, but with the charms, it had to be. I guess they could have just made designated slots for the charms though.


What is everyone's favorite class so far? Mine is definitely Brick.